Insights For Entrepreneurs | TiE Global With Sadhguru in Challenging Times

00:06 - Mahavir Sharma: Namaskaram Sadhguru ji. Good morning, good afternoon, good evening and namaskaram everyone.

00:14 - On behalf of TiE, TiE Global, I am Mahavir Sharma, the current chairman of TiE global, I welcome all of you, whether you are TiE members, non-members, across various channels, not only just Zoom.

00:26 - First and foremost I’d like to thank our partners and supporters – _____ (Unclear) Bank for giving us this technical support, Vikas and his team at TiE UK North for bringing this to us, everyone at the Isha Foundation who has worked very hard in the last five or six days to bring up the right questions, thank you everyone.

00:45 - For most of you who don’t know TiE or who are new to TiE, I’ll just give you a one minute introduction to TiE.

00:51 - TiE is the world’s largest non-profit organization promoting entrepreneurship across the world, was established in 1992 in Silicon Valley, now we’ve spread out to sixty-one cities across the world, fourteen countries and each and every continent possible.

01:08 - We start… our main mission is to promote entrepreneurship.

01:12 - We catch the young, we start from a school’s program, go onto our college’s program, help young business people and we mentor them, guide them, support them and handhold them in every way.

01:24 - Recently we’ve started to invest at the bottom of the pyramid, at the early stage and idea stage start-up ecosystem.

01:31 - We’re investing as angels across US and India and we really look forward to nurturing entrepreneurship, promoting more and more people successful across the world.

01:41 - I thank Sadhguru ji for giving us the time.

01:45 - I really look forward to these sixty minutes of knowledge which is going to be focused on young entrepreneurs, senior entrepreneurs, businesses and professionals.

01:54 - Over to you Vikas to start off the questions, please.

01:59 - Vikas Shah: Okay. Namaskaram everyone.

02:01 - Welcome, my name’s Vikas Shah, I’m the president of TiE UK North and today we’re joined by thousands of entrepreneurs and leaders from all over the world, brought together by our mutual interests for our remarkable guest today, Sadhguru.

02:15 - I first met Sadhguru through Daniel Donakey who’s in the audience today.

02:20 - Danny asked to make sure that your football team allegiance is still where it should be Sadhguru ji (Sadhguru laughs).

02:28 - But today we are not here to talk about sports, we’re here at a time, where the world is going through one of the most profound shared experiences that we’ve all had, since the last great outbreak of conflict.

02:41 - So today I’d like to start Sadhguru, by asking, you know, we’ve had a devastating effect on the world from this virus.

02:51 - It’s changed the balance of power in relationships and societies, but it is not a human invader, it is a virus.

02:58 - How should we as individuals, as society and as countries think about this situation that is happening to us? Sadhguru: Namaskaram.

03:11 - Well, when you said it’s not a human invader but virus, you are making it like being infected by a virus or this virus pandemic is worse than the World War II that you were referring to, in some way.

03:29 - Well we need to understand this, most people don’t know what is a war.

03:36 - Like for example, in India though we have seen four wars and America, probably in the post-World War I’m saying, America must have seen about four to five wars.

03:48 - But for India the wars are fought on the border, our soldiers have fought on the border, sacrificed their lives, but for the Americans the wars are fought a… somewhere else.

04:00 - But to… just yesterday we are commemorating the end of World War II, you ask the Londoners what war meant at that time, because every home was destroyed and around you there’s a whole lot of destruction.

04:17 - That is not a joke. So virus is not as big as a war, though we have to handle it in a war-footing, it is not as big.

04:25 - Let’s not make it… let’s not magnify it that big because being shot at, being bombed out is a different experience than… right now this virus, it is not even being carried by some mice or mosquito or something else that we cannot control.

04:39 - We are the carriers. All we have to do is, if we behave responsibly and consciously, we can stop the virus in its tracks right now, because without us it can’t go anywhere.

04:50 - When we are the transportation system for the virus, isn’t it in our hands to stop? But that is not how a war happens.

04:57 - When a war happens, it is a totally different affair.

05:00 - So having said that… but at the same time, this is so universal that is… this is co…

05:06 - literally covering the whole planet or the entire human population, so it is big, it is not small.

05:13 - Well, many things we have been doing. Well, all of you are entrepreneurs, what I say you may not like a little bit, but I want you to sit back and think because right now economy has sort of come to a near-standstill situation.

05:30 - When machine has stopped, it is a good time to maintain and fix that machine because a running machine it’s very difficult to fix.

05:38 - Nobody will have the focus to fix a machine, especially if it is running well, then nothing can happen.

05:45 - I must tell you this, in 2008 when I was at the World Economic Forum, well there was a bit of a… you know, a meltdown and everybody was carrying a long face.

05:58 - These thousand and odd people, most of them billionaires, they were a few billionaire… billions less and they were harr… carrying such long faces.

06:07 - So they asked me to handle a session called (Laughs), “Recession and Depression. ” I said, “Recession is bad enough, you don’t have to get depressed on top of it. ” And above all, right now the way we have built the economic engine on this planet that it is going at a certain speed, if the economy goes down a little bit, you will be depressed.

06:33 - But if economy goes full steam, we will be damned on this planet.

06:38 - So this is a choice, whether we want to be damned in the next thirty to fifty years’ time or we want to be little depressed? We don’t have to be depressed.

06:48 - This is not death, okay? This… this stoppage of economy does not mean death of hu… human life nor does it mean economic collapse.

07:00 - It’s a slowdown for sure. It is going to hurt every one of us.

07:04 - As individuals it is going to hurt as, as entrepreneurs, small entr… enterprises, large enterprises, very mega-businesses, nations – every one of us have pain to go through.

07:17 - One important thing is, during this period all of us should take the responsibility of staying alive (Laughs), this is the most important thing because we are doing business, we are doing enterprise, only because we value life.

07:29 - Because we thought our enterprises, our busine… businesses will add value to our life, that’s the only reason why we are doing this.

07:37 - So human enterprise is fine, but right now a situation has come which has slowed us down a little bit – not little bit, quite a bit.

07:45 - Certain industries may have to just close down because they won’t be able to recover from this kind of a dip.

07:51 - And human behavior, if the virus stays on effectively killing people for twelve months, human behavior will change quite significantly and many businesses may become redundant (Laughs).

08:06 - People are fearing, God may become redundant! They’re scared if temples, mosques, chu… churches don’t open, God may disappear, so they are fighting for that also.

08:16 - So I’m saying, the insecurity is not just among you, even the God is feeling insecure that if nobody comes to pray for twelve months, what do you do? After that they may not come at all.

08:27 - They may do fine without it (Laughs). So ma… Vikas Shah: And… but with this as well, you know, one of the most profound changes to society right now has been the disconnection of humanity.

08:40 - You know, we have been separated from each other, as businesses, as families, as groups and fear has set in.

08:48 - How do you suggest that, first of all, how do you suggest we can cope with disconnection? And secondly, how can we cope with the fear when we do come to return? Sadhguru: About disconnection, see people… when economy was running well, businesses were running well, families were complaining that, “We are disconnected, there’s no time for each other. ” Now six weeks is not going to disconnect you from the world, it is a good time to connect with families, friends and everything.

09:21 - Anyway we are connected, so connected, with you know, social media and so many other ways, anytime you can pick up a phone or send a message.

09:30 - We are connected. Even people who are working in the same offices were sending emails to each other, they were not talking to each other, so nothing has changed for them, in many ways.

09:38 - So let’s not exaggerate that disconnection but is there a concern? A serious concern, not a joke.

09:46 - This is not going to be a joke. I am not saying, “This is not of any gro… great consequence,” it is.

09:53 - But at the same time, tell me would we have, as human beings, as societies, as nations, always all of us trying to be be… you know, do… do better than others, would we have stopped and looked at, “How to redirect the economy?” We would not have done, till a major disaster happens.

10:12 - I would say this is a soft disaster, unfortunately over a quarter million people have died.

10:17 - But if climate change disasters happen, much more will die.

10:21 - So instead of that, this is a soft one, this is the time that we need to restructure our businesses, restructure the way we run the economy.

10:29 - What is success itself, we need to redefine.

10:31 - For example, in the last fifty years, from 1970, sixty percent of the vertebrate population has disappeared.

10:39 - There are many, many explanations being given, accusations being made about where the virus came from, how it happened and all this.

10:47 - But the fundamental, simple thing. See, yourself also, I’m saying both of you are outside the country? Or you’re in India and he’s in UK right? Am I right? Vikas Shah: I’m in Manchester and Mahavir is in India.

11:00 - Mahavir Sharma: I am in Jaipur. Sadhguru: Okay, you are (Laughs)…

11:02 - Don’t tell me you are a United fan or something (Laughs)? Vikas Shah: I’m sorry, I can’t disclose my team affiliations, because Danny’s one of my best friends.

11:14 - Sadhguru: Okay (Laughs), that’s a good one (Laughs).

11:17 - Now the thing is, see why is it that many Indians have gone out? Because there was no opportunity here, so they’ve gone out and thrived all over the world.

11:29 - Similarly, any life will do the same thing.

11:31 - I’m speaking for the virus because virus is also a life.

11:37 - We cannot be alive without microbes and pathogens within our body, without bacteria and virus we cannot be alive.

11:45 - This one virus is right now causing trouble, so we think virus is our enemy.

11:49 - No. Virus is also life. They were doing fine among the animals, especially among other mammals in the animal kingdom.

11:56 - But the vertebrate population has gone down sixty percent since 1970 and this… the way the population is going down, what it means is – for the virus there is no habitat, it has to jump somewhere, so it found us somehow.

12:13 - Whether it jumped in a market place or a laboratory, whatever, this is a debate, we do not know what the answers are for this.

12:19 - But it has jumped one way or the other and this is not the first time it’s jumped.

12:23 - Many times these things have happened. When the Spanish Flu happened, over fifty million people died.

12:28 - In India, twelve to seventeen million people died, that’s not a small number.

12:32 - When the world’s population was just two billion people, fifty million people died.

12:38 - So right now a quarter million people have died and especially in a time like this where our ability to travel is quite limitless, every day people are flying all over the world.

12:48 - In spite of that it is pretty good because our awareness, our medical systems, everything is way better.

12:54 - So we can make this disaster, we can make this virus situation into a minor aberration in our life rather than making it into a major calamity, if only we conduct this properly.

13:07 - About fear… fear means, you must understand this, about what may happen tomorrow.

13:13 - So essentially what is happening is, right now there is a challenging time in front of us.

13:19 - True, really challenging times, like never before for our generation of people.

13:23 - This is the most challenging times we are facing.

13:26 - When there is a challenge in front of you, you must be at your best, this is the most important thing.

13:31 - When there is a challenge in front of you, your competence becomes the most important thing that you need to do.

13:38 - Tell me when you are in fear, are you very competent? No, the basic faculties will be lost, you will become debilitated with fear.

13:49 - So what is the logic behind this? The thing is just this, whenever there is a challenge in fr… front of you, your own intelligence turns against you.

13:59 - Right now, let’s not decide what to do tomorrow because we still do not know how the virus will play out.

14:06 - We do not know. Everybody is making their own guesses but nobody…

14:10 - I’m listening to all the scientific stuff that is going on in the world, what doctors are saying, politicians are saying, economists are saying, but the clear picture is this, we really do not know how things will be in another two months’ time.

14:23 - Nobody knows for sure how it’s going to play out.

14:26 - People are saying it’s already mutated into ten different forms.

14:29 - Whether it will respond to the vaccine, how many… ten vaccines for 7. 6 billion people.

14:34 - When will you give that vaccine? This is not practical things, anything that is being spoken.

14:39 - So we have to wait. When we wait, the best thing to do is, right now to upgrade ourselves.

14:46 - Upgrading ourselves means, our… our psych… our physiological capabilities, physically we must become fitter.

14:51 - In the next one month, all of you TiE people set this up, in the next one month, you must be at least ten percent fitter than what you are right now, physically.

15:00 - Mentally, you must be ten percent sharper, I can give you tools for this.

15:04 - And emotionally, you must be at least ten percent more balanced.

15:08 - Energetically, you must be at least ten percent more effervescent.

15:12 - All these things will be most vital, when you have to step out and face that new situation that we have still not figured.

15:19 - Let us not assume this will happen, that will happen, because we don’t know what will happen.

15:24 - How many of us will be wiped out, how many of us will be here, how many businesses will be gone, how… what will be relevant, what will be not relevant, – we have no clear picture.

15:34 - Only guesswork is going on. So, using our imagination we are causing fear.

15:39 - Instead of that, this time around, let’s invest it upon ourselves to make ourselves into more competent, more balanced and better human beings.

15:47 - That’s the only way you can face an unknown situation.

15:51 - Vikas Shah: Thank you, Guruji. Now, in a moment I will pass to Mahavir who has some questions from our TiE chapters around the world.

15:58 - Just before we do that, do you think that a crisis like this will change the relationship that we have to our material possessions, our relationship with wealth even? Because these are also very important questions for business leaders is, will this change the nature of what we think is important, when it has been money and wealth in the large part for such a long time in society? Sadhguru: See, most human beings are existing like they’re immortal.

16:32 - People think (Laughs)… most people think, “Other people die,” you know? No, no, you and me will die.

16:39 - It is just that we don’t want to have an untimely death, that’s all.

16:43 - But you and me will die, we are all dying sort.

16:46 - So now virus has brought the mortal nature of our existence right up in our faces, which is a very good thing.

16:53 - If we don’t die, it’s a good thing. But we realize, we are mortal but we did not die, is a very good thing to happen to a human being.

17:01 - Because mortality means just this, that you understand that you are on a limitl… limited lease of time.

17:08 - If you understand that you are on a limited lease of time, you will definitely organize your life in a more meaningful way than the madness with which people are going on right now.

17:20 - Definitely it needs to happen, I hope it happens.

17:23 - But after nearly five weeks of lockdown, in India they opened the liquor shops.

17:29 - Wooh, everybody forgot everything and they piled up like animals on each… on top of each other, they had to close it down now.

17:36 - Now they are doing home delivery of liquor, for the first time (Laughs).

17:40 - Get drunk and be home, don’t come out and do a mess.

17:44 - So nothing changed for these people, at least.

17:47 - But if… definitely if the virus situation and this fear and this social distancing lasts for more than nine to twelve months, definitely the way we relate to what we possess will definitely change and that is a welcome change.

18:03 - Vikas Shah: Thank you Guruji. And now I’d like to pass to Mahavir Sharma in Jaipur who has some questions from our TiE Global chapters.

18:10 - Mahavir Sharma: Thank you Vikas and thank you Sadhguru ji.

18:14 - So the first question is from two chapters across different part of the world – Singapore and Silicon Valley.

18:21 - And I’m changing the topic from coronavirus and the current crisis to general entrepreneurship and business and I think we need to move on, as you rightly said in your replies.

18:31 - So, as I told you, we have start-ups, young start-ups who are struggling, cash-flow issues who are, you know, becoming tougher and tougher… established business people also struggling and not knowing what the future is.

18:45 - So my question is that all of us have to become stronger as you said, mentally and emotionally and also spiritually in my opinion.

18:54 - The inner engineering that we all need to work or rework as entrepreneurs, as start-ups, as professionals, what should one do to restructure oneself from within? Sadhguru: See, it is going to be a challenging terrain, no question.

19:09 - Whatever the nature of your business, certain businesses will do very well post-virus (Laughs) for their own reasons.

19:17 - But even those businesses will have to be agile and he… handle the new terrain that will come in front of them.

19:25 - If you want to approach… Let us say, you are in Rajasthan, let’s say you want to travel the Thar dessert, you would want a machine which is well-engineered, isn’t it? You don’t want to go into a desert with a badly engineered machine where anything could happen.

19:44 - So now we are approaching a place where the terrain is not going to be as you expect.

19:51 - Unexpected terrain, that we may hit lots of bumps, lots of pits, all kinds of things.

19:57 - Nobody knows what kind of challenges it will throw, but we clearly know it is going to be a very challenging situation for anybody who is managing anything.

20:06 - Businesses, nations, institutions, individual lives, everybody will have their own kind of challenges.

20:13 - So when this happens, the most important thing is that you are well-engineered.

20:17 - What does engineering mean? See, we say something is well-engineered because it functions the way we want it, isn’t it? If a machine functions the way we want it, if the building functions the way we want it, we say this is a well-engineered structure.

20:33 - So similarly, in your life, your body, your mind, your emotion, your energy should work for you.

20:40 - Just now he was mentioning about fear. Fear, anxiety, anger, resentment, hatred, whatever, anything that is unpleasant within you, for this people may go on giving many reasons, today there are over 72,000 exotic names for psychological disorders of various kinds.

21:01 - You can give as many names as you want, but essentially what has happened is your intelligence has turned against you for some reason, whatever the reason.

21:11 - Fundamentally, your intelligence has turned against you.

21:14 - There are only two kinds of sufferings in human life – physical suffering and mental suffering.

21:20 - If the virus gets us then there is physical suffering.

21:23 - That’s a different matter, we need to deal with it completely differently.

21:26 - The rest is all mental suffering, ninety-five percent of human suffering is mental suffering.

21:32 - What mental suffering means is, you are on… when it comes to suffering, you are on self-help.

21:38 - You don’t need any outside help. Right now, sitting at home you will think about something that may happen ten days ago and already suffer something which does not exist.

21:49 - What is it that human beings are suffering? What happened ten years ago, they still suffer.

21:54 - What happened ten years ago does not exist, so what you are suffering is, you’re suffering your memory.

21:59 - Or what may happen day after tomorrow, they already suffer, this means you are suffering your imagination.

22:06 - So if you are suffering your memory and imagination, one thing we need to understand is that as human beings we have a very vivid sense of memory, that’s why our lives are so rich.

22:17 - No other creature on this planet has the kind of memory and detailed memory as we have and no other creature has a fantastic sense of im… imagination that human beings have.

22:28 - Now you are suffering your memory, you are suffering your imagination means you are suffering your evolution of becoming a human being.

22:35 - So most people would like to have half the brain that they have right now, so that they can be peaceful.

22:41 - So when it doesn’t work that’s why they soak it in alcohol so that half is preserved for some other time and they feel little peaceful for some time.

22:50 - Well you know when it goes completely out of control the doctors even… even going to the extreme stage of doing what is called as lobotomy, that a part of the brain is removed.

23:01 - If a part of your brain is removed, no fear, no anxiety, no some… nothing, peaceful, but no possibilities either.

23:08 - So I am saying, what is a possibility, you are making it into a huge problem, simply because you are not well-engineered.

23:16 - What does being well-engineered mean when it comes to a human being? You’ve heard of… you’re in UK, so you’ve definitely heard of Charles Darwin, right? Nobody did not hear about him (Laughs).

23:29 - He didn’t come from Manchester, I think. VikasShah: He wasn’t perfect, so (Sadhguru laughs)… Sadhguru: I get you (Laughs).

23:39 - You must be from the city, Manchester City, that’s why you’re talking about perfection (Laughs).

23:45 - So, Charles Darwin went about… I’m making it simplistic, but he was saying something like this – a goat could have become a giraffe over a million year ti… period.

23:56 - A pig could have become an elephant over many more million years, but a monkey became human rather too quickly, so quickly that anthropologists are continuously looking for a ‘missing link’ which they have not found yet.

24:12 - So what it means is, in terms of DNA difference if you look at it, between a chimpanzee and yourself, the DNA difference is only 1. 23% – 1. 23% is not much of a difference, so physiologically we are very, very close to a chimpanzee but in terms of our intelligence and our competence and our awareness, we are worlds apart from a chimpanzee.

24:37 - So right now human problem is just this, they have an intelligence for which they don’t have a stable enough base, so they are suffering their own intelligence.

24:46 - You can call it tension, fear, anxiety, madness, misery, whatever you want to call it, essentially human beings are suffering their on… their own intelligence.

24:57 - Intelligence is a solution, intelligence is not a problem.

25:00 - Unfortunately, most people are experiencing this as a problem, this is why Inner Engineering becomes very, very significant.

25:07 - If you are an entrepreneur, you must understand you are into a venture.

25:12 - You are in a venture means it is just one step st… short of an adventure, okay? You are seeking, you are seeking challenges.

25:21 - If you did not want challenges, Rajasthan government would have been a fine place, you know (Laughs), to work, but you become an entrepreneur because you are consciously seeking a challenge.

25:33 - This means you are into a venture which is not an adventure but just one step short of that.

25:40 - That means you should not suffer unexpected situations.

25:43 - Unexpected situations, undefined situations means for an entrepreneur there are a million possibilities in that.

25:50 - He has to look at it. Mahavir Sharma: Thank you, thank you so much.

25:55 - Going on with my next question, nothing to do with the current situation.

25:58 - This is from Anjali in New York, Ram from TiE UK North and a team in TiE UP.

26:05 - You know, what causes, and this is a very generic question, feelings of unpleasantness, disconnect, dissatisfaction, unhappiness within oneself in life? And these things invade yourselves and you actually you under deliver or under, you know, work and that creates a challenge for everyone and one has to compromise on whatever business or job that one is doing.

26:28 - Or sometimes even people become procrastinated (procrastinators?) because they are comparing themselves from (with?) other people.

26:33 - So this emotional dis… and many a times, people don’t even know that they have these inner challenges because or satisfaction… dissatisfactions.

26:39 - How does one control or deal with inner emotions and become stronger emotionally? Sadhguru: (Laughs) You said underperform, what I say… what I say right now, this is not to insult anybody, but I’m saying over ninety-five percent of the human beings on the planet are underperform (underperforming?) all the time.

27:04 - They may be comparing themselves to somebody else and doing little better than them and they think they are okay.

27:09 - It is not a way to look at life. The important thing is, “Am I at my fullest possibility?” Whether I am better than somebody or worse than somebody, this is not the issue.

27:21 - Unfortunately that’s become the issue but that’s not how it should be.

27:24 - Whether I am able to find full expression to all that I have in me? If you go by that context, over ninety-five percent of the population is seriously underperforming.

27:35 - (Laughs) If anybody comes to me here, those people who came here thinking, you know, spirituality means they can close their eyes and do, you know tch, whatever that kind of stuff, I am all making them do five people’s work.

27:51 - Each one must do five people’s work, otherwise I’m not satisfied (Laughs), and seven days of the week, three-hundred-and-sixty-five days, we are on, on and on.

28:00 - Why I am saying this is because this is most important in a human per… perspective that everything that you have should find expression.

28:11 - If it doesn’t find expression it will become knots within you, which will bother you.

28:15 - You won’t even know why. Simply for no reason, simply you feel, you know, unfulfilled, kind of like there is a bad weather within you, no matter what is happening.

28:28 - So you can call it by many names, as I already said, there are many ways of looking at it.

28:33 - One simple way of looking at it is, see human experience has a chemical basis to it.

28:39 - What you call as joy is one kind of chemistry, what you call as misery another kind of chemistry, peace is another kind of chemistry, love is another kind of chemistry, agony is one kind of chemistry, ecstasy is another kind of chemistry.

28:53 - So right now we can look at it in this simple way – if you create the right kind of chemistry within yourself, you will be blissful every moment of your life.

29:04 - Being blissful means your body, your mind, your emotion and your energies are pleasant because pleasantness is very vital for a human being and that’s all you are looking for.

29:15 - See, you want your body to be pleasant. If your body is pleasant, we say this is health; if it becomes very pleasant, we say this is pleasure.

29:26 - If your mind becomes pleasant, we say this is peace; if it becomes very pleasant, we say this is joy.

29:32 - If your emotions become pleasant, we say this is love; if it becomes very pleasant, we call this compassion.

29:39 - If your very life energies become pleasant, we call this blissfulness; if it becomes very pleasant, we call it ecstasy.

29:47 - If your surroundings become pleasant, we call this success.

29:50 - Well, all of you are entrepreneurs. That has been your focus, to make your surroundings pleasant for yourself.

29:57 - But, when you want to make your surroundings pleasant there are many ingredients in the surroundings.

30:03 - You will have to have some mastery over many people, many situations, various aspects in the world, then only surroundings will become pleasant.

30:12 - For this, it is a question of competence. But to make your body pleasant, to… emotions pleasant, mind pleasant, and energies pleasant, it’s one hundred percent your business.

30:24 - To make your body, mind, emo… emotion and energy pleasant, it is absolutely your business.

30:30 - Surroundings are a different matter, that is a question of competence.

30:35 - Not everybody is equally competent when it comes to the outside, but if you are willing, everybody is equally competent when it comes to the inside it is just that nothing has been invested in that direction.

30:46 - In the sense, your entire schooling system that is there in the world today, tell me is there any… even a moment’s focus as to how you should be? It’s all about how is the bacteria, how is the cockroach, how is the frog? We even opened up these things and looked inside how they are working.

31:05 - But there is not a moment of turning inward and looking at what is… what makes a human being, what makes a human being tick, what makes him go down, what makes go up, is there any science like that in the school? So, entire schooling system has been like this.

31:21 - From there everything has built up, our businesses, our institutions, our nations and societies have built up on the same format on which our education systems have been built.

31:31 - So based on this, we have not invested anything, so there are no results.

31:36 - Well, the question is coming from New York.

31:39 - Unfortunately, New York State is going through a really bad bout of this thing, it’s terrible out there.

31:45 - But let’s say United States, if you take United States as an example, hundred-and-fifty years ago, ninety-three percent of the U. S. population was illiterate.

31:55 - Today, it’s hundred percent literate, I believe.

32:00 - How does this happen? Somebody invested in the infrastructure of schoolrooms, teachers, human infrastructure, physical infrastructure.

32:08 - Because of the infrastructure, today everybody is literate.

32:11 - I am asking where is the in… infrastructure for inner well-being? That’s what we’re trying to build around the world.

32:17 - To build infrastructure for inner well-being of the human being, that is one basic focus of Inner Engineering.

32:25 - Fortunately today we can do it virtually, see you are in different places, we are talking to you.

32:30 - Fortunately, for the first time in the history of humanity, we can sit in one place and talk to the whole world.

32:37 - Why I am saying this is, if you look back on the history of this world, many great beings have come who had solutions for the world.

32:44 - Well, a Krishna came, he could talk only to one person.

32:48 - A Buddha came, he spoke to a few hundred people.

32:52 - A Jesus came, just twelve people and one of them freaked on him.

32:56 - Like this, this has been the history of this humanity.

32:59 - This is the first time that we can talk to the entire world sitting in one place.

33:04 - When there is an opportunity like this, if we do not transform human consciousness, that means we’re simply not interested.

33:11 - So, this virus has given us a break from whatever we have been doing, I think this is a great time.

33:17 - You are all entrepreneurs, you must also look at this, how to raise human consciousness? Whatever you need, in terms of material, support, whatever, I am willing to give you, Isha Foundation is willing to give you.

33:28 - You make a… you build an enterprise of transforming humanity, because that is the biggest business in many ways and that is a most vitally needed business on the planet.

33:40 - Mahavir Sharma: Sure. Thank you. And that leads to my next question, and you know, of course conscious is very, very important and philanthropy and charity and working for the society is always great.

33:54 - And TiE, you know, has been promoting this philanthropy after… for all successful people and we do a lot.

34:01 - This question has come from TiE Coimbatore and TiE Rajasthan.

34:04 - You know, so doing charity, doing good work, doing work for social impact always makes one very happy, the inner glow as you say, the inner strength that come from within is very, very strong.

34:17 - Can you enlighten what happens, what chemistry happens in one’s self when does… someone does good work for other people? And also if you would like to talk about your charities that you are working and how we can collaborate, as you just mentioned.

34:29 - Sadhguru: See, wherever an individual human being puts another human being or some other human being’s well-being above our own, suddenly that situation becomes a very powerful situation.

34:44 - We have the fortune of constantly li… living among such people.

34:48 - It is the greatest fortune I have that always I’m among people who are not concerned about themselves, they are concerned about what they can do for what is around them.

34:58 - So, that is a fantastic situation. It is good, those of you who are doing businesses or who’re engaged in variety of things, families to raise and all these stuff.

35:06 - In that, you take time to do this, it’s a great thing.

35:10 - And you must know this joy, you must know the joy of operating beyond your limitations, because the only thing that a human being is looking for is expansion, please look at this.

35:21 - Wherever you are, whatever you are right now, you want to be something more.

35:26 - If that something more happens right now, you want to be something more.

35:30 - If that happens right now, you want to be something more.

35:32 - If you look at this, you want constant expansion.

35:36 - So, how much expansion would settle you for good? If you look at this, even if I make you the king or queen of this planet, you will not settle.

35:46 - You will want the solar system. If I give you one solar system, you will want the universe.

35:51 - If I give you one universe, you will want the galaxies.

35:53 - It doesn’t matter if I give you a billion galaxies, you will want something more.

35:58 - This is the nature of a human being because this one (Referring to oneself) doesn’t like boundaries, it wants to expand.

36:06 - If we have this longing in a very basic physical way that we want to be more than who we are, in… if it finds a very basic physical expression, this is called sexuality.

36:18 - You are trying to be something more than who you are.

36:21 - If it finds an emotional expression, we will say this is love.

36:26 - You are trying to include somebody as a part of yourself.

36:30 - If it finds a mental expression, people will say this is ambition, this is conquest or (Laughs) maybe simply shopping.

36:38 - No, maybe I shouldn’t have uttered that word.

36:41 - People must be missing that activity so much, and they may suffer because I mentioned the word.

36:46 - Mahavir Sharma: Online shopping is open I think (Sadhguru laughs).

36:48 - Sadhguru: No, in India that is also not there (Laughs) right now.

36:52 - Yes. Mahavir Sharma: Only essential goods.

36:55 - Sadhguru: So, essentially you are trying to be more than who you are.

36:59 - Even your acquisition of wealth, property, money, what is this? This is just about expansion.

37:05 - So, in a way, when you look at life, not just in terms of myself and mine, but something that’s unconnected with you, you want to invest something in that life, there is a sense of expansion and that’s what you are enjoying.

37:19 - That you must know always. This is what yoga means.

37:22 - Yoga means union. Not necessarily emotional or psychological, simply the way you exist, there is a sense of union with everything around you.

37:32 - In this union there is ultimate pleasure and blissfulness and peaks of ecstasy which most people would never know in their life.

37:41 - This is something every human being must experience in this life, because we have come with the possibility.

37:46 - Why should we miss it? Mahavir Sharma: Thank you, thank you so much.

37:50 - Now, I’ll hand it over to Vikas to ask the next questions and we would now be discussing character and the future of the society, moving on from the present (Overlapping conversation)… Sadhguru: There was… there was one part of the question which I did not answer.

38:01 - If I can take a minute… Mahavir Sharma: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

38:03 - I am sorry. You forgot to talk about your charities, yes we need to know about ____ (Unclear)… Sadhguru: So well, I…

38:07 - I never thought I am doing any charity. I tho… (Laughs) I am just doing what’s needed.

38:13 - In that sense, right now, you know, it is very painful to see that even in the rural India, there are so many people, migrant labor and others who are stuck without food.

38:25 - It’s running into thousands every day, our volunteers are out there, ensuring that, you know, we have created this thing, that this part of Tamil Nadu doesn’t have a single case of virus infection, because our volunteers are there, taking care of this, supporting the police, supporting the government officials, serving food to all those people, no movement.

38:45 - Not a single case has appeared in this entire region of Tamil Nadu because we are on the ground.

38:52 - This is what needs to happen to stop this, this is one aspect.

38:55 - Well, there are issues in this country. What we are focusing on is education, nourishment-health together, and ecology, these are the three main issues in the country and in the world also in many ways.

39:09 - So in terms of ecology, we are largely focusing on changing the policy.

39:14 - Right now, we are in the process of unrolling a movement called “Conscious Planet. ” It has been pushed by six months because of this virus, but we will be rolling it out later on.

39:25 - We want all of you to be a part of this. The idea behind this is just this.

39:30 - Right now, if we don’t make the corrections, if we do not make the correction, even now, the number of people dying in the cities is way higher.

39:39 - Even during Spanish Flu this was true. Wherever the particulate matter was beyond 2. 5, you know, micrometers or whatever, there always the deaths were higher, even during the f…

39:53 - Spanish Flu, and the same is happening now.

39:55 - So, the number of people who die just because of pollution causes is very, very high, and those people are also susceptible to these kind of things.

40:05 - Having said that, to bring down the pollution, there is… people are thinking electric cars, this, that.

40:11 - Yes, all that needs to happen, but the most important thing that needs to happen is a mass transport system, which is super efficient then naturally people will go by that.

40:20 - There are many plans for which policy changes, we have put forth to the government, they have become the official policy recommendations for all the states in India.

40:28 - Now, we are trying to do this for the whole world.

40:31 - What we are looking at is just this. Ecological issues should become election issues in every country.

40:39 - For this to happen, we’re ma… we have a list of three top political parties in every nation, all the hundred-and-eighty-seven nations which have democracies.

40:49 - We have top three po… political parties and we are approaching them.

40:54 - And at the same time, see the political parties will not do anything unless people really want it.

41:00 - So, we are seeing how to touch 3 to 3. 5 billion people to vote for, you know, f… simple things.

41:09 - We are making, right now, whatever ecological information that’s out there, is all like PhD stuff.

41:14 - Nobody un… understands what it is. The common man on the street has no clue what it is all about.

41:19 - We are making this into five things that must happen in your country.

41:23 - We are making the world into segments in terms of latitudes or geographical segments of equatorial region, tropical, sub-tropical, temperate, like this.

41:35 - And in this region if your country is there, what should happen? What are the five things that must happen? Two or three things that should never happen in your country? We want to make sure at least 3 to 3. 5 billion people, because 5. 26 billion people have franchise in this world.

41:51 - That means, they have the power to elect a government.

41:54 - If three billion people understand these five things and they vote, they’ll say, “Yes, we will vote for this,” this means it will become an election issue.

42:02 - So, we are seeing how to get to that three billion number.

42:06 - We have various plans, we will come to you sometime.

42:08 - Please all of you should stand with us, because this is a ‘must-happen. ’ Because right now about twenty-five percent of the world’s land is untouched and pristine.

42:18 - It is estimated by 2050, only ten percent will be left and populations will touch nearly ten billion.

42:25 - Well, that is a calamity by itself – absolute calamity, you don’t need any virus.

42:31 - If we become ten billion people and forests have reduced, no enough forest cover and green cover in the world, this will be a disaster.

42:40 - But, right now we have a phenomenal chance to change a few things.

42:45 - See, of the fifty-one million square kilometers of land which is being used for agriculture in this world, forty million, forty million square kilometers of land is used only to raise animals and their food because of meat consumption.

43:02 - If meat consumption is brought down by fifty percent, people don’t have to give it up.

43:06 - If they bring it down by fifty percent, twenty million kilo… square kilometers of land will become available.

43:14 - Twenty million square kilometers means, you can p… you can plant 1. 2 trillion trees.

43:19 - 1. 2 trillion trees means, everything, all the carbon that you have thrown out into the atmosphere, in fifteen to twenty years’ time, it will fully absorb.

43:30 - That’s what it means. This can be done, and it can be a huge business by itself.

43:36 - Timber can be a huge business by itself, we can crop the timber, but in a… in a calculated way.

43:44 - This can be done, this can be a major business, as meat industry goes down, this can be done.

43:49 - This is a big enterprise by itself, you must look at that.

43:51 - Above all, all of you should stand with us for “Conscious Planet. ” Mahavir Sharma: Thank you so much and we will help you reaching out to masses across the globe and educating people about what you said.

44:05 - We’ll share a document with your team. Over to you Vikas to take it forward, please.

44:10 - Sadhguru: Thank you. Vikas: Thank you.

44:12 - Guru ji, over the last four, five years in particular, we have seen so much disharmony, disunity and fractures emerge in our society whether we look at it in a referendum or elections, or whatever it might be.

44:25 - And we do, as you said, need to come together as a society for many important causes, such as the environment.

44:32 - But why are we still turning to those base instincts, such as hate and isolation and how can we build society which is more unified regardless of religion, or opinion, or background because that is so important for us? Sadhguru: See, that’s what it looks like on the surface but essentially this is happening because economics has become the most significant aspect of human life right now.

45:08 - Once economics become the most significant aspect, “What have you got? What do I have?” This is the whole calculation all the time.

45:16 - So, when it’s all based on this, naturally people will polarize themselves, because they know there is strength in unity and brotherhood of their own.

45:26 - So, it may look like religion on the surface, it may look like so many other things, but if you look at it, the underlying force is economic concerns.

45:37 - Now your Brexit, you’re talking about is an economic concern.

45:40 - It’s not a racial thing or a even a national thing, it is more an economic concern.

45:46 - So, economy or economic well-being has become the only concern, there are no other concerns in human life.

45:54 - Right now, even in London, I see do… people don’t even discuss weather anymore.

45:58 - They only talk about the stock prices, and what is happening (Laughs), what is happening here.

46:02 - Even if you sit around, I’m saying, I was somewhere, where about four, you know, senior ladies were sitting, and I sat with them for a small tea or something.

46:13 - Even they’re talking about stock prices! I said, “Don’t you discuss weather or local gossip anymore?” No, all that is gone, the only gossip is economic gossip.

46:22 - When this happens to any society, naturally we will, you know, we will make groups of our own, because that gives us power.

46:31 - If we are left alone by ourselves, we may be smothered by the economic forces.

46:35 - So, we need to change this. In many ways… if I (Laughs), if I say this, it looks like I am rubbing, you know, insult to injury.

46:44 - Right now, the economy has slowed down, this is the time for all of us to rethink many things about our lives, how we’re living? Is this the way we as human beings should exist on this planet? Is it really…

46:58 - The way we are existing is quite unbecoming of being human.

47:02 - We are as violent or worse than any other animal creature.

47:07 - An animal functions out of its instinct. Instinct essentially means a crystallized amount of memory within itself in its evolutionary scale and from that memory it operates.

47:18 - The significance of being human is whatever our instincts are, whatever our genetic background and evolutionary background is, this moment you and me can function, we have a discerning mind that we can function consciously.

47:35 - No matter what our history says, what our genetics say, what our evolution says, whatever it is the background, still we can stand above that and acts… act consciously, because we are the only ones who have a discerning mind which can act beyond our own instincts.

47:54 - If we do not exercise this, we are not really full-fledged human beings.

47:58 - That’s what it means. Vikas: Wow. And in a moment I’ll hand over to Mahavir as well to give an official vote of thanks for today.

48:07 - But one final question if I may, Guruji, which is, you know right now we are all introspecting, we are all, you know, on our own or you know in small groups, and it’s causing us to almost focus on some of the negatives that we are seeing in society.

48:24 - But how can we make sure that we look outwards, how can we make sure that we see beauty and positivity even in a time of great crisis and uncertainty? Sadhguru: (Laughs) The negativity is coming from…

48:40 - I think, all of you are trying to practice astrology.

48:44 - You are planning to probably start an astrology company, so you are trying to make predictions about which you have no clue.

48:51 - Don’t make predictions right now. Just carefully watch what’s happening in the world, every little bit that’s happening.

48:58 - Because you are an entrepreneur, there could be a thousand opportunities in many, many things that are happening.

49:04 - This may make you look like… ma… make me look like, “Oh, what is he talking! When there’s a human disaster, you’re talking about enterprise?” Well, enterprise matters because the success of a nation no more depends on its military might or even on its political circus that it does.

49:21 - Essentially it depends on the success of its businesses.

49:24 - So, it is very important that business people don’t become astrologers and start making predictions and gloom and doom stuff.

49:32 - No, you just wait, it’s okay. When… when we step out onto the street, let’s see what to do.

49:37 - We must watch carefully. But the most important, as I already said is, this is the time that you will never get again probably in your life.

49:45 - Till now, since you started your enterprise, I am sure nobody gave you an eight-week break, isn’t? Simply impossible, even to think.

49:53 - Vikas: Yeah. Sadhguru: Even I am… (Laughs) I am here at the Yoga Center continuously for two months, which I have not done in forty years (Laughs).

50:02 - So, I’m thoroughly enjoying my stay here and doing the best we can do.

50:07 - We have to completely reinvent ourselves to function in the new world, because our programs are always 10,000, 15,000, 25,000 people.

50:17 - That’s not going to happen in the next twelve to twenty-four months probably.

50:21 - Vikas: Wow. Thank you so much. Sadhguru: Yes.

50:25 - So (Laughs)… Vikas: And if I may Guruji, I’ll… at that point I’ll hand back to our global chair, Mahavir Sharma.

50:31 - But thank you so much for joining us today.

50:34 - Sadhguru: You must do Inner Engineering (Laughs).

50:36 - Vikas: (Overlapping conversation) I’ve already registered.

50:38 - Mahavir Sharma: Thank you Vikas. Guru ji, you know, there is, you know, all of us in our lives, forty-fifty years have done something or the other wrong, or taken steps that haveturned out to be wrong.

50:50 - There is always a sense of guilt at times of what we had done in the past.

50:55 - You know, someone from TiE Florida is just asking the fact that moved to U. S. two decades ago, suddenly he feels that he was selfish, and he moved out of India, he cannot prove his loyalty, love for India.

51:06 - And most NRIs, or Non-Resident Indians of non-resident countries, people always feel that towards their country and they get… you know, they can’t prove themselves or they can’t prove it to the world that their love for both the countries is equal and there’s parity.

51:20 - How does one get rid of this guilt, specifically this or generally this? Sadhguru: (Laughs) See, right now (Laughs), right now one thing that we have in India plenty is human beings, all right? We are nearly 1. 35 billion people.

51:38 - For these 1. 35 billion people, we don’t have the economy, the size of economy that would properly serve these human beings.

51:49 - Right now, we are striving to build that. Economy we will build, we are confident about that, but we don’t have enough land for 1. 4 billion people to live well.

51:59 - We don’t have enough water for 1. 4 billion to live well, we don’t even have a piece of sky for 1. 4 billion people to live well.

52:08 - So, our thing is to produce va… very competent, focused, inspired and balanced human beings and export them to the rest of the world.

52:19 - If half a billion people if we export, the whole world is ours, what is the problem? Geographical boundaries should not be so restrictive, all right? Nation is just an idea.

52:31 - Nation is just an idea in our mind. We have love for things that we have gone through, in our childhood and whe… where we have seen and grown up.

52:40 - That is perfectly fine and that’s wonderful, because a human being is as complex and as capable, and as sophisticated, simply because as I said, vivid sense of memory we have.

52:51 - We must celebrate that memory, we must remember that memory.

52:54 - Well, those people who are feeling that way, they’ve… many of them have come from small villages and now they are doing very well in United States or wherever else.

53:02 - Well, they can take up one, one village and take care of it.

53:05 - You tell me if you want to take care of any village in Southern India, we will take care of it for you, if you contribute.

53:10 - We will see all the children in that place are educated, and many more people like you are produced and I am not… I am not talking about brain drain, this drain.

53:19 - We have enough brains and enough bodies, we can send them around the world.

53:24 - This is another way of conquering the world, out of our love and inclusion, not by conquest.

53:30 - So, they don’t have to feel guilty, they just have to do well.

53:34 - And if they have the needed resource, they can take up something in India, which will make a difference.

53:40 - Don’t take up something else, some fanciful romantic stuff.

53:43 - The only thing that you need to take up is children, education and ecology.

53:47 - This is it. If we… because we have people and people, if we produce very focused, inspired and competent population, we will be a great miracle.

53:59 - If we fail to do that, these 1. 4 billion people will be a great disaster.

54:03 - So, we are… we intend to make this into a great miracle, because that can only happen by investing in people.

54:11 - But now we are little concerned with this virus because last twenty years we have pulled out two-hundred-and-forty million people out of the poverty, below poverty line.

54:23 - But now, if this lasts for twelve months or more, that two-hundred million plus people may go straight back below the poverty line once again.

54:33 - That is our concern. So, the most important thing that needs to happen is nourishment, education and ecological concerns are there.

54:41 - If these three things you can contribute and attend to, please do that for India.

54:46 - But you don’t have to feel guilty about your well-being – no, not all.

54:49 - Mahavir Sharma: Thank you. One last question I think I can squeeze in, four-five minutes to go, and pull you into the debate of life versus livelihood.

54:56 - The US is, you know, leaning towards livelihood and economy.

55:02 - Indian government is in a dilemma, red… you know, green, orange zones don’t have as much of a business or economy, red is where all the problem is.

55:09 - What is the right balance? What is the future immediately for us as entrepreneurs or the government, and is there a balance somewhere? Sadhguru: See, this is not about taking sides.

55:26 - We should not take sides at times like this.

55:29 - Unfortunately, people are so geared to always take this side or that side.

55:33 - That’s not it. As I said, we do not know how it will unfold in the next two to three months.

55:41 - When the Spanish Flu happened, in the first wave, immediately after World War I when the first wave happened, started in the month of January, it killed about six million or seven million people.

55:52 - People thought it’s over. But it came back in August, September and killed over thirty-five million people straight away.

56:00 - And it again came back next year to kill some more people, but that second wave was the biggest one.

56:06 - Is this virus going to behave like that or not? We do not know.

56:10 - We can only go by what’s happened till now.

56:13 - In the past, it’s happened in the… in the, you know, just little over a century, exactly the same thing has happened.

56:20 - It’s the second wave which really got us. Even now some of the doctors and scientists are saying, the second wave in US will happen in October, November, December and that’s going to be really big.

56:33 - Well, if that is the thing, you step out and kill two, three million people or ten million people, or whatever.

56:39 - I don’t know how many, unfortunately. That will not be good in terms of livelihood.

56:46 - Even if we look for livelihood, coming out and protesting in thousands together, openly defying the simple care that you need to take us… take, so that it doesn’t spread, talking about… See, scientific language like ‘herd immunity,’ this and that, without understanding what it is, before herd immunity comes…

57:05 - If we go for herd immunity, I am telling you, we will wipe out the geriatric population completely.

57:11 - We will wipe out all those people who have gone through organ transplants, cardiac patients, diabetics, all vulnerable population, largely we will remove them.

57:21 - Is that what you want to do in terms of livelihood? Yes, we definitely have to restart the economy, time has come.

57:28 - More than six to eight weeks if you close down, it will become a major problem.

57:32 - But how to do it must happen in a planned way, not coming out and talking about your rights on the street.

57:38 - Your rights are there, but there are also responsibilities of being in a democracy, isn’t it? Because when what you do is not just about your life, it’s going to take somebody else’s life, when doctors are being forced to make these kind of decisions…

57:52 - In Italy this was done, that is, suppose me and my mother get admitted into the hospital for the virus, they will give the ventilator to me and let my mother die.

58:04 - How will I live with that, that I took the ventilator and made her die? Or if me and my daughter get admitted for the same problem, they will give it to my daughter, I will die.

58:14 - When people are being forced to make these kind of decisions, you are talking about your rights, you want a haircut! Come on! Just fifty years ago, you didn’t want to have a haircut, all right? Now you are saying you can’t live without a haircut, barber shops you want, that is the most important thing.

58:32 - Alcohol you want. Please, this is a time where little more responsible and conscious action should come forth from human beings.

58:39 - Should economy restart? One hundred percent, there is no question about that.

58:43 - But how? It must happen in a systematic disciplined way, not in a wild way.

58:49 - Mahavir Sharma: Well, thank you, thank you so much for such great, insightful answers to our questions raised from across the world.

58:59 - On behalf of TiE, all its member and the entire fraternity, I would like to thank you and Isha Foundation for bringing this up to us.

59:07 - We will collaborate and work with you closely, in social impact and environmental issues soon.

59:12 - And thank you _____ (Unclear) Bank once again, thank you Vikas, thank you Peter for doing a fantabulous job.

59:18 - Thank you everyone, Namaskaram. Sadhguru: Thank you very much all of you.

59:24 - Thank you. Instrumental music….